halftrackinfo
steering => all steering related topics => Topic started by: steve1973 on May 01, 2014, 01:10:31 AM
-
Hello all,
Need some advice. My steering box has been leaking since I got my track. I thing it is about dry now as it is getting harder to turn the wheel. I'm going to attempt an on frame rebuild if that is possible. I plane to remove the frender and lower armor panel to get access to the steering box. I will then clean and remove side cover and place a new gasket. My question is there any other seal or gasket I should replace? I don't want to pull the column if necessary. How about the sector shaft? Is there a seal for that? Any help is appreciated.
Thanks,
Steve A.
-
If you can get the steering wheel off take the column out. Will save all the work of taking off the fender and working around everything else in rebuild.
Steve
-
Thanks Outsider for the advice. That is exactly what I did. With the help of Don we got the steering wheel off with my puller form Saturn Surplus, disconnected the drag link, clutch/ brake return springs, removed two bottom nuts, removed U-bolt and dash support and the hidden bolt just above the pitman arm and she came on out. What a greasy mess. I got the column disassembled and soaking in wash tank. I do have some questions.
1) Does any one know of a source for Ross steering box parts?
2) I need the shim kit as I think mine is to tight
3) I need the upper mast bushing/bearing. Someone said an M35 one would work but haven't found a source yet.
Here are some photos so far.
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1855.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1854.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1856.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1857.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1858.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1859.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1849.JPG)
lower bearing cup, some minor pitting and wear
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1852.JPG)
upper bearing cup, same as above, pitting and wear
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1853.JPG)
More to come.....]
-
I have one other question, When I go to assemble the box again and lub it what gear oil should I use? I looked in the manual and couldn't find it. Also, I hear of just packing it with grease. What do you think, oil or grease?
Steve A.
-
Oil only. Grease will work its way away from the bearings and such over the coming years. I don't remember what the ht calls for, but normally 85w/120 will work good. If you are going to drive it in the winter you may want to use 85w/90 to make steering a little easier in the cold.
What are you referring to as "to tight"? Does the steering wheel have any slop or play in it? Is the steering column just to hard to turn without a load on it?
The bolt with the jam nut in your picture is for adjusting lash in the gears. If it is too tight it will be hard to turn, if it is too loose you will have slop or play in the steering.
Steve
-
I think the end play with the bearings is to much. Their is no slack or play at all. That is why I think the cups are warn with a slight travel groove. But again I'm no expert. I had no play in the column when in use. its getting harder and harder to turn the wheel when driving. I know about the bolt to adjust the lash and will have to figure that out to.
Thanks,
Steve A.
-
I got out to the shop today and picked up a new bag of blast media for my blast cabinet. What a difference it made. I had everything cleaned up in an hour or so. I found a place in California for steering box parts. I will let you know if it pans out. The key is a stamped number on top of the box. Not the casting number on the cover. Also, What color is the steering wheel? I'm going to repaint mine and it looks like it was originally black. I see no OD green on it other than some over spray from some touch up painting. Here are some photos of my progress.
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18641.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18621.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18651.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18671.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18681.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18631.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18601.JPG)
Here is the stamped number on top of the housing.
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18661.JPG)
Steve A.
-
I'm making little progress in finding parts. I have all the housings cleaned and sent over for paint. I hope to get parts next week or I will have to see about making my own. Here are some photos of my cleaned steering wheel.
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18861.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18871.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN18881.JPG)
Steve A.
-
Steve since you just took your steering wheel off can you tell me how and where that lil seat installs under the steering wheel but above the upper shaft bearing?. I took my wheel off years ago and forgot.
In the pic its between the steering shaft spring and wheel nut
-
That is the seat that goes on the upper column bearing for the spring, then spring and wheel.
-
does the tapered end sit into the bearing or snap onto the spring?
Thanks
-
It faces up into the spring.
-
like this?
-
Yes! ;D
-
Once again thanks steve!!
Yes! ;D
-
You can buy very thin shim stock from Mcmaster Carr. http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-shims/=s0roe3 . It comes in different metals and thicknesses, and the thin stuff can be cut with a scissor or sheet metal shears.
Steve
-
one more question steve, what keyway is used? 12 oclock or 1 oclock position?
Andy
-
Andy,
Honestly, I don't remember. I didn't even realize there were two key ways. :(
Steve A.
-
Well it's slow getting parts for the steering column but I got a part in today. ;D It is the upper bearing assembly from a M35 duce. It is identical in every way. I got it from Memphis Equipment, https://memphisequipment.com. It was $27 and change for the bearing. I also got some paper gasket material to make my own cover gasket. The only other item I'm looking for is the shim pack. I might just go back with what I had and try that. The column is being painted this Thursday-Friday so I will start reassembly next Monday.
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN19111.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1912.JPG)
Steve A.
-
one more question steve, what keyway is used? 12 oclock or 1 oclock position?
Andy
Andy- I took mine apart today- and the key was in the 1 o'clock slot on the steering wheel. This slot also lined up with the spoke.
If in doubt-after you install your box, line up your wheels then install the steering wheel so it is timed right.
Michael
-
i dont know if the shims are the same as the m35 truck but they kind of look the same in this link.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-M35-STEERING-GEAR-UPPER-HOUSING-SHIM-SET-7696384-NOS-/250678691216?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item3a5d9d4590&vxp=mtr
steve
could you post the part numbers for that upper column bearing.
i cant read them from the pic.
-
Steve-0, That's what I've been looking for. Just bought a set and will let you know if they are the same. ;D
Steve A.
-
Thanks Michael,
yesterday i tried for awhile to install the pitman arm on the box with the keyway at the 12 and no way could i get it on, but when I tried the 1 it went on easy.
Andy
one more question steve, what keyway is used? 12 oclock or 1 oclock position?
Andy
Andy- I took mine apart today- and the key was in the 1 o'clock slot on the steering wheel. This slot also lined up with the spoke.
If in doubt-after you install your box, line up your wheels then install the steering wheel so it is timed right.
Michael
-
Thanks Michael,
yesterday i tried for awhile to install the pitman arm on the box with the keyway at the 12 and no way could i get it on, but when I tried the 1 it went on easy.
Andy
Good to know, They must have shared this wheel with another vehicle. I wonder what?
Thanks,
Steve A.
-
I managed to get my steering box and column back together last Friday in time for a car show Saturday morning. My Dad was a big help with installing the assembly back into my track. I think it took me at most four hours to get everything back on and went very smoothly. I neded up making my own gasket and re using the bearings and cups along with most of the shims. I did get a new seal and shim kit thanks to Steve0. The steering is still hard so I think it needs anothe shim to loosen it up just a bit. Other than that I'm very pleased with the results. Here are some photos.
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1919.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1920.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN1922.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN19241.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN19291.JPG)
(http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/data/500/medium/DSCN19301.JPG)
Steve A.
-
Just finished up rebuilding my steering box and thought I'd pass along a little more information. Quite a few M35 parts will work with the half-track. The column bearing assembly part number is B170241, which includes the bearing, retainer and spring. If you need a nut for your steering column it is a 7/8-20 thread, which is also the same as an M35, part number 5167785. The bearing races and bearing balls, as well as the shims for the worm gear are also interchangeable with the M35.
Respectfully, I disagree with one of the earlier post regarding the placement of the retainer. As shown in TM 9-2320-209-34-2, the purpose of the retainer is to create an interference fit between the column bearing and the steering shaft. Consequently, the retainer should be placed into the bearing with the spring pushing down on it.
-
Thanks for the update and clarification. I'm in the process of compiling a list of parts and numbers that are interchangeable with halftracks. This info will be added. I didn't know that the bearing races are the same. Which column are you restoring? There are two types for the halftrack. One that fits M3A1 scoutcars and M2 series halftrack (smaller box) and one that fits the M3 series halftracks (larger box). The components are different in this area. The shims, column bearing are the same though.
Steve A.
-
I'm restoring the larger gear box for a M3A1 half-track. DW